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JMROD · 08-10-2007, 10:04 AM

I can see both sides of the argument here and I stand somewhere in the middle at this point in my life but Ill play a bit of the "no tax" side.

Its not a question of helping and "improving the future", its about choice. Somone comes and tells me "you must use your money for this because I say it helps us all". Well isnt it my money? Shouldnt I be the one to decide what to do with my own money? Its about the freedom to choose.

I may also prove that there are tons and tons of kids growing up in broken down homes and this is the true bane of society. It wouldnt matter how much money you throw into the public education system those kids have issues and they could care less about learning or have to much to handle to properly function at school. My wife is a teacher and I hear about this first hand. She really takes it personal when her kids dont do well and I try and explain that she can only do so much. I tell her she has those kids for 1 hour out of the day for one year in their entire life. Its very difficult to replace what a broken home is not providing and its not the public school systems job to be parents.

You might be suprised but some parents actually expect the schools to do things THEY should be doing. "I am paying taxes for this YOU should be doing everything for MY kids education, if they fail its because of YOU because I pay taxes...so I have done my part now here are my kids go teach!" (just an idea of the type of attitude in some parents, no one actually said this in those words). Its very sad...very sad. Some poeple just dont deserve to have kids. Anyone can make kids but not all are willing to be parents or understand what parenting means.

Another way of argueing against the "education needs more money" side is this. Assume there is a company A and company B. Which do you invest in? The one that over spends irresponsibly and really does nothing to improve thier bussiness with money they have recieved so far, or the company that is just the opposite? My point is, and I have talked about this with my wife, sometimes the answer is not more money if poeple do not know how to properly manage it. So 10 cents out of every dollar I pay in taxes actually get used properly (made up numbers to prove points) and it makes sense to keep throwing money at it? We have to make sure there is proper managment and responsiblity before we keep throwing money.

Do you know what type of attitude there is amoungts teachers in the public school system? They are there for themselves, not the kids. This is not true of all teachers, schools or districts but this attitude is definetly in my wifes school and I think there are many like it. They are not there in the interests of the kids. They have very poor atitudes and are there for paychecks and summers off. Now, again, I know not all teachers are like this but I believe this is evident if not prevelant in the public school systems and probably only in the "bad" areas.

If this is prevalent in bad areas what does that mean? I believe it backs up what I have felt and believe for the most part of my life. Most if not all problems begin in the home. Throwing 100 billion more into schools cant fix the home. It may help but maybe there is a way our money can better "help our kids and the future".

Sorry I got started and couldnt stop. I will stop now. I have made some points on one side of the debate but in reality I stand somewhere in the middle. I am not sure I have the right to tell my neighbor "pay for my kid to go to school so that he doesnt grow up a looser and steals your car in a few years". That logic is a bit clouded IMO. At the same time I know I cant expect society to be fine if I dont step up and help out in some way. We "good" poeple cant just stand by and watch the "bad" poeple take over and influence society. Teaching is really a calling not a career. Its very hard and I think they are one of the most important poeple in the world. I believe we can improve the quality of teachers by making it so that they get paid what they deserve. For these reasons and more I am somwhere in the middle but I am not sure taxes are the solve all. I am for having the most advance, sophisticated and effective education system in the world and I believe this would have a profound effect on our future. I would be willing to pay for this but should I get the choice?

I can keep going but I will stop now for sure this time.

08-10-2007, 10:04 AM	#69
JMROD Drives: 2SS RS ABM "Bumbleblue" Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: So. Cal Posts: 60	I can see both sides of the argument here and I stand somewhere in the middle at this point in my life but Ill play a bit of the "no tax" side. Its not a question of helping and "improving the future", its about choice. Somone comes and tells me "you must use your money for this because I say it helps us all". Well isnt it my money? Shouldnt I be the one to decide what to do with my own money? Its about the freedom to choose. I may also prove that there are tons and tons of kids growing up in broken down homes and this is the true bane of society. It wouldnt matter how much money you throw into the public education system those kids have issues and they could care less about learning or have to much to handle to properly function at school. My wife is a teacher and I hear about this first hand. She really takes it personal when her kids dont do well and I try and explain that she can only do so much. I tell her she has those kids for 1 hour out of the day for one year in their entire life. Its very difficult to replace what a broken home is not providing and its not the public school systems job to be parents. You might be suprised but some parents actually expect the schools to do things THEY should be doing. "I am paying taxes for this YOU should be doing everything for MY kids education, if they fail its because of YOU because I pay taxes...so I have done my part now here are my kids go teach!" (just an idea of the type of attitude in some parents, no one actually said this in those words). Its very sad...very sad. Some poeple just dont deserve to have kids. Anyone can make kids but not all are willing to be parents or understand what parenting means. Another way of argueing against the "education needs more money" side is this. Assume there is a company A and company B. Which do you invest in? The one that over spends irresponsibly and really does nothing to improve thier bussiness with money they have recieved so far, or the company that is just the opposite? My point is, and I have talked about this with my wife, sometimes the answer is not more money if poeple do not know how to properly manage it. So 10 cents out of every dollar I pay in taxes actually get used properly (made up numbers to prove points) and it makes sense to keep throwing money at it? We have to make sure there is proper managment and responsiblity before we keep throwing money. Do you know what type of attitude there is amoungts teachers in the public school system? They are there for themselves, not the kids. This is not true of all teachers, schools or districts but this attitude is definetly in my wifes school and I think there are many like it. They are not there in the interests of the kids. They have very poor atitudes and are there for paychecks and summers off. Now, again, I know not all teachers are like this but I believe this is evident if not prevelant in the public school systems and probably only in the "bad" areas. If this is prevalent in bad areas what does that mean? I believe it backs up what I have felt and believe for the most part of my life. Most if not all problems begin in the home. Throwing 100 billion more into schools cant fix the home. It may help but maybe there is a way our money can better "help our kids and the future". Sorry I got started and couldnt stop. I will stop now. I have made some points on one side of the debate but in reality I stand somewhere in the middle. I am not sure I have the right to tell my neighbor "pay for my kid to go to school so that he doesnt grow up a looser and steals your car in a few years". That logic is a bit clouded IMO. At the same time I know I cant expect society to be fine if I dont step up and help out in some way. We "good" poeple cant just stand by and watch the "bad" poeple take over and influence society. Teaching is really a calling not a career. Its very hard and I think they are one of the most important poeple in the world. I believe we can improve the quality of teachers by making it so that they get paid what they deserve. For these reasons and more I am somwhere in the middle but I am not sure taxes are the solve all. I am for having the most advance, sophisticated and effective education system in the world and I believe this would have a profound effect on our future. I would be willing to pay for this but should I get the choice? I can keep going but I will stop now for sure this time.