[shaffe]

Originally Posted by DorkMissile

IMO it really has nothing to do with the type if car, it is the fact that the domestic car companies cant make as good of commodity vehicle as the Japanese or Koreans. Not saying they cant make a good car, GM can make a good $40k 2 door performance car, but they cant make as good of a $20k 4 door sedan.

Throw in the fact that the deprecation on a domestic sedan is 2-3x that of a Japanese or European equivalent.

I agree with this ^ I hate to say but it seems like they just can't make as good of a midsize sedan as the Japanese. I'll touch on that more later.

Originally Posted by MackSteelPrivateEye

GM...needs to be revamped from the Top Down...starting with Berra. They complain that can't sell cars. Well look at them...they are boring cookie cutters except for the Camaro and Vette. We all saw the new Caddy they may build, we have other sweet looking Caddys but they never get built. Maybe if they built them they would sell. Trump is right...he told Berra to start building cars that sell instead of just giving up. I think its pretty sad that GM can't come up with a real campaign to build cars that sell. Just shows the wrong people are in place at the top.

I agree on the cars. They need to be better, and IMO if they copied the Japanese a little they could pull it off.

Originally Posted by oftenimitated

Just bought a new Honda Accord Sport. $23,500 before tax. its a 4 cyl turbo, manual, with a good number of features, adaptive cruise, lane assist, etc. Has 19" wheels on it, LED heads and tails. Only thing I wish it had was full leather and heated seats, maybe sunroof.



GM doesn't even have a car to compare at that price point. Cruze is smaller, malibu looks horrendous and doesn't have the options or price point with the options or even a manual option, smaller wheels etc. Impala looks good in LTZ form which is more $$, but is also a dated style. Chevy needs to stop putting so much chrome on their front ends, it looks cheap!! Like the styling of new chevy truck minus the mirror placement and they really didn't modernize the interior anymore like RAM did.



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This ^ My Focus died earlier this month, and it put me behind the 8 ball to get a new car. Now it was before I was ready so I knew I had to get a responsible choice with the little guy, and keep it in a modest budget. I looked Fusion's, Malibu's and then Accord, Camry and Mazda6. My Mazda6 has adaptive cruise control, sunroof, 19" wheels, city brake assist, lane keep assist, 250HP, 310 LB/FT of tq, heated leatherette seats and auto climate control, the list price on my car was 30 and all of that was standard! Only option was the paint. Couldn't come close to that in a Fusion or a Malibu. A comparable Malibu was over 36K and the Fusion was over 35K. The Accord came really close, but I liked the way the Mazda drove much better. Even on the styling front, IMO the Mazda6 is the best looking midsize car in the class (slight bias!) and the accord is a close second. The Mazda is definitely the best driving car in the class and that along with the long list of standard features at a relatively low MSRP is what made me jump from domestic to the Japanese. I think Ford and GM could look across the pacific and see how they are building their midszie sedans and take some serious notes.

Originally Posted by Snowbird12

Here is some ideas for GM
Forget the GMC. And Chevy brands
Have one truck not 2 like the F150
Have one big Suv. Line not 2
Get 3 sizes of cars That look different
We bought a Cruze because of the style, now it looks like a malibu or Sonic or Impala
Stop the same product with different names like the small suv line
There are too many choices in the Camaro line with no easily defined model like the ss with the very small logo
Also with the age of computers, why cant we custom build our cars like the old days
Not everyone wants an SS with all the bells and whistles just a greatV8 with few options
I dont like the package option system they have
Dare to be different GM
Not everyone wants a cookie cutter car with black interior

I agree I don't like the option system the way they have it, but that makes it cheaper to manufacture instead of ala carte like they used to be. The Japanese makes (and now Ford to some extent on some models) are making it so that cars have basically 0 options. If you want different features you have to go up a trim level. I think this is better than needing a tech package or sun and fun package.

Originally Posted by Jim50thSS

The idea that there isn't a market for these cars is absurd. I think the problem is that the price for these cars is what is driving them out of the market. I love my car but I feel dumb for paying almost 50gs for it. I considered buying a Yukon until I saw the price tag. Ten years ago, I could have bought the Denali AWD for the same price as the base model SLE 2WD. In time they will struggle competing with the trucks and SUV's as well.

There is still a market for sedans, they just need to make them better. When I was looking, it wasn't really even close for me the Japanese sedans were way better,