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Old 01-31-2007, 11:50 AM   #15
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The Camaro may actually be much more important to GM right now than the G8 and Impala. Currently, this company has absolutely nothing exciting to offer customers who are willing to pay $20-$30,000. There current product lineup is bland and unless you've got the big bucks to get a Corvette or Cadillac, there is nothing in their lineup to give the company a pulse. Remember that this is a company that is not in the best of shape and they need an exciting flagship car that's affordable to lots of people to get people to the showrooms to draw attention to other cars, like the Impala and G8. There success also depends on the image of the company, and a car like the Camaro gives an image of excitement and innovation.
I don't think he was saying that the Camaro is not important to GM. I think it is very apparent that this car is extremely important for the reasons you already stated. However, the G8 and Impala are much more important from a financial standpoint because these are GMs volume cars.

With that said, I don't know that the Camaro has to be mutually exclusive of the G8 and Impala. Just becasue they are in a hurry to get their volume cars under production doesn't necessarily mean they do not have the resources to do the same with the Camaro.

With that said, I still think it will hit the showrooms late in 08.
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Old 01-31-2007, 12:13 PM   #16
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I don't think he was saying that the Camaro is not important to GM. I think it is very apparent that this car is extremely important for the reasons you already states. However, the G8 and Impala is much more important from a financial standpoint because these are GMs volume cars.

With that said, I don't know that the Camaro has to be mutually exclusive of the G8 and Impala. Just becasue they are in a hurry to get their volume cars under production doesn't necessarily meant hey do not have the resources to do the same with the Camaro.

With that said, I still think it will hit the showrooms late in 08.

I have a feeling one of the reasons why they say '09 release and stick with it is to fool the competition. Best way to make the car a big success and steal away market share from the Mustang is to say late release date, and then spring it on them sooner than expected. That thinking does make sense. The Mustang isn't due for a big horsepower increase until 2009. If they get the Camaro out the door in '08, GM will take a significant market share for muscle cars by doing so and maybe become a frontrunner down the road.

A sneak attack on Ford is quite plausible and will make the Camaro a much bigger money maker.
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Old 01-31-2007, 06:48 PM   #17
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I agree 08 what part I don't know. but why would a company want to sneak attack this car when there are people that are saving now that would drop a deposit on it if they knew it was going to be out real soon. and for people like me that are saving I would save even more if I knew for a fact it was going to be out sooner. yes they shouldn't tell everyone under the sun it's coming out really early but they shouldn't wait to long to tell us when.
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We do not want to use the Z28 moniker on a car that does not deserve this hallowed name.
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Old 01-31-2007, 08:40 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by rray200 View Post
I have a feeling one of the reasons why they say '09 release and stick with it is to fool the competition. Best way to make the car a big success and steal away market share from the Mustang is to say late release date, and then spring it on them sooner than expected. That thinking does make sense. The Mustang isn't due for a big horsepower increase until 2009. If they get the Camaro out the door in '08, GM will take a significant market share for muscle cars by doing so and maybe become a frontrunner down the road.

A sneak attack on Ford is quite plausible and will make the Camaro a much bigger money maker.
Sneak up on Ford who kept on selling the Mustang and laughing all the way t the bank? I don't see how that 'strategy' will fool anyone... The Mustang has always been lacking in HP from the Camaro and will continue to do so IMO. Of course I'm talking about the normal showroom vehicles like the Mustang GT vs Camaro Z28.
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Old 02-01-2007, 08:21 AM   #19
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Sneak up on Ford who kept on selling the Mustang and laughing all the way t the bank? I don't see how that 'strategy' will fool anyone... The Mustang has always been lacking in HP from the Camaro and will continue to do so IMO. Of course I'm talking about the normal showroom vehicles like the Mustang GT vs Camaro Z28.
Ford has always been successful selling the Mustang because the car never became too expensive like the 4th gens eventually did, and they've had little competition. Sure the LS1s have always been more powerful, but at a much higher price. Ford really isn't exactly sure how much the 5th gen will sell for. If its right in the Mustang's wheelhouse with significantly more HP, GM will have cut the legs out from underneath them, because Ford's modular engines can never match the LSX series engines in power. Ford will have to do alot of R & D in a hurry to come up with something better, and it's doubtful they can do it.
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Old 02-01-2007, 10:57 AM   #20
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well nice article and I can not wait.
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Old 02-01-2007, 11:57 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by rray200 View Post
Ford has always been successful selling the Mustang because the car never became too expensive like the 4th gens eventually did, and they've had little competition. Sure the LS1s have always been more powerful, but at a much higher price. Ford really isn't exactly sure how much the 5th gen will sell for. If its right in the Mustang's wheelhouse with significantly more HP, GM will have cut the legs out from underneath them, because Ford's modular engines can never match the LSX series engines in power. Ford will have to do alot of R & D in a hurry to come up with something better, and it's doubtful they can do it.
Take a look at these MSRP prices:

2002 Mustang GT Coupe - $22,965
2002 Mustang GT Convertible - $27,220

2002 Camaro Z28 Coupe - $22,495
2002 Camaro Z28 Convertible - $29,590

How was the LS1 Z28 a much higher price then the Mustang GT?
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Old 02-01-2007, 12:56 PM   #22
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Take a look at these MSRP prices:

2002 Mustang GT Coupe - $22,965
2002 Mustang GT Convertible - $27,220

2002 Camaro Z28 Coupe - $22,495
2002 Camaro Z28 Convertible - $29,590

How was the LS1 Z28 a much higher price then the Mustang GT?
In Canada it was. Not fully familiar with the US pricing. But in Canada the pricing was as follows:

2002 Ford Mustang $22,895 (base V6) - $35,170 (GT)

2002 Chevrolet Camaro $27,270 (base V6) - $39,500 (Z28)

When it came to the SLP SS models, those started in the low $40,000s and could go well over $50,000 with all of the SLP performance options. This does not include the 15% in taxes you pay North of the border.

So yes, I am not completely correct in my US analysis. But as far as why the 4thgen failed in Canada, its pretty obvious with these prices.
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Old 02-01-2007, 01:00 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by OverAnxious View Post
Take a look at these MSRP prices:

2002 Mustang GT Coupe - $22,965
2002 Mustang GT Convertible - $27,220

2002 Camaro Z28 Coupe - $22,495
2002 Camaro Z28 Convertible - $29,590

How was the LS1 Z28 a much higher price then the Mustang GT?
Assuming a 3% inflation rate per year, that would put the 5th gen Z/28 coupe under $30k!

If they can seriously produce a 400+HP Camaro for under $30k I will be one happy camper
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