GM (Cadillac) to continue ICE production past 2030

[olrocker]

Just as I suspected, GM has done an about face and will now continue to build ICE Cadillacs past 2030.

https://www.autonews.com/automakers-...cles-past-2030

Queen Mary gets to eat some crow now.

She axed the Camaro too quickly. And people think she’s such a great CEO.

[Evergreen6]

I'd rather the company change course than continue down a path that turns out to not improve the company or the product. That's what a competent leader does. There's no reason to stick to a goal like total electrification just for the sake of taking a side or being right.

I think the piece about the Camaro lacks context which has been discussed in myriad threads. EV or not, the Camaro was dead. End of story.

[olrocker]

Originally Posted by Evergreen6

I think the piece about the Camaro lacks context which has been discussed in myriad threads. EV or not, the Camaro was dead. End of story.

Your opinion. Not fact. You’re wrong, plain and simple.

End of story.

[Mr_Draco]

Originally Posted by olrocker

Your opinion. Not fact. You’re wrong, plain and simple.

End of story.

Funny how someone calls something that is actually a fact, that is backed up with numerous statistics and sales figures, an opinion and then calls it wrong. And then follows it up with stating his opinion, that is backed up with nothing other than a belief, a fact and that it is right.

[90503]

Cadillac...the brand that can do no wrong!...lol

I've come to believe that no matter what happens at GM/gm they have plenty of previous statements and plans that will validate any circumstance as if "that's what we've said all along"...."All EV by _____!". Well, no, that was just an aspiration! (if it doesn't happen) and we did just as we said! If it does, or comes close.

So, I don't put much stock into anything much they say will or won't happen. In Cadillac's case, what an odyssey...Move the hq to NY., oops, well move it back....Let's market model names after neuton weights or whatever the hell...lol...Let's bring back the old legacy names, let's not!...etc.

I always argued that Cadillac needed the Camaro more than the other way around to keep that assembly line viable. But Camaro (which sold more, gone!) and Caddys from that same line, still going!

I think gm realized finally that some sales are better than none. Experts at ending existing lines like Impala, Cruz, Bolt, Camaro....but not so much at starting up new ones. What I used to believe that these decisions took years of planning and were written in stone on what to build and discontinue, now it seems like gm's plans are month-to-month on what to build. Ev-ICE_..now Hy-brid!! Although perhaps we are witnessing more aspirational lip-service again "just in case".

The rationale for ending the Camaro was more applicable to Cadillac, yet it's always Cadillac that soldiers on unfettered.

I think Cadillac is gm's Mustang. It will continue regardless of sales or popularity, or cash bleeding.

Mary and gm can't end everything that is currently in production. They have to sell something.

My $.02.

[FarmerFran]

If it is true and they do keep ICE variations, Is anyone really surprised?

[olrocker]

Originally Posted by FarmerFran

If it is true and they do keep ICE variations, Is anyone really surprised?

No. My whole point was that I don’t think any of us who really know cars are surprised, because we were saying the VAST majority of Americans do not want EV no matter what.

It’s a niche that may survive a roughly 8-10% market share long term, over the next 20 years.

GM should have just never made the “Cadillac will go all-electric” promise to begin with. Looks really bad.

[Mr_Draco]

Originally Posted by 90503

I always argued that Cadillac needed the Camaro more than the other way around to keep that assembly line viable. But Camaro (which sold more, gone!) and Caddys from that same line, still going!

The rationale for ending the Camaro was more applicable to Cadillac, yet it's always Cadillac that soldiers on unfettered.

I think Cadillac is gm's Mustang. It will continue regardless of sales or popularity, or cash bleeding.

Caddy is the money maker. Their world wide sales is probably more than anything else GM makes. That is why Caddy models stay around regardless of what it looks like here in the US.

[el ess A]

gm isn't the company they once were, IMO. They're starting to even suck out loud. They're just another brand out there selling ho-hum trash like everyone else. They haven't made a really good vehicle lineup in years. They should ditch their cars/SUVs and just build trucks. It's about the only thing they're good at any more. Instead of leading and innovating, they're chasing others and flip-flopping. Not a good look.

[olrocker]

Originally Posted by el ess A

gm isn't the company they once were, IMO. They're starting to even suck out loud. They're just another brand out there selling ho-hum trash like everyone else. They haven't made a really good vehicle lineup in years. They should ditch their cars/SUVs and just build trucks. It's about the only thing they're good at any more. Instead of leading and innovating, they're chasing others and flip-flopping. Not a good look.

Exactly. I think everyone knew the bankruptcy would change the company but I think everyone was thinking fewer cars and trucks but better cars and trucks. More focused. Less overlap, less waste, better overall product.

Not a transformation into a bland appliance company with no clear direction.

This is no longer GM.

It’s gm

[FarmerFran]

Top 5 (6) Auto makers worldwide

Toyota 10.3million
VW 9.2 million
Hyundai 7.3 million
Stellantis 6.3 million
gm 6.1 million
Ford 4.4 million

The USA outlook is not much better

[olrocker]

Originally Posted by FarmerFran

Top 5 (6) Auto makers worldwide

Toyota 10.3million
VW 9.2 million
Hyundai 7.3 million
Stellantis 6.3 million
gm 6.1 million
Ford 4.4 million

I’ve said it before in other threads - Toyota is kicking a$$ right now. They’re making cars and trucks people actually want. Desire. Can’t wait to buy.

I think it was around 2017 or 18 that Toyota’s CEO said “we’re done making boring cars”

They actually offer four vehicles with a real, 3 pedal manual transmission (Corolla, Supra (albeit mostly a BMW but still), GR-86, Tacoma) - they can’t keep those in stock if they tried.

The new Tacoma, 4Runner, Land Cruiser, Tundra lineup is the best low-medium-duty truck and SUV lineup in the entire American market right now. GM - er, sorry, gm - and Ford still make the best full size and heavy duty trucks in Silverado and F Series. And seriously, if I could get a Silverado 2500 6.2 with a real 3 pedal manual transmission I probably would.

Be that as it may, eventually I will be ordering a new Taco TRD off road 6 speed (don’t worry the Camaro is going nowhere).

Toyota is right now the company GM was 30 years ago.

[Capricio]

I used to funnel all my monthly expenses (cell phone, electric, trash, etc) through my GM rewards card is 4% return is one of the best return rates out there, if you're going spend it on a gm vehicle.


After dumping about 5 years worth of accumulated balance into my Camaro purchase (and the dealer let me put about $4K on my gm rewards card yielding 7% that I paid off immediately), I gradually came to realize that unless my truck were destroyed (only 40k miles on a 2017), there is nothing left in the gm portfolio that I want.



Every car I have owned, my entire life, has been from gm. So, this was kind of pivotal for me. I didn't cancel the card but I transitioned all my expenses to a different cash back card that pays out a lower rate with no categories. The balance from the Camaro purchase is just sitting there. Every once in a while I get a spam email from Goldman-Sachs encouraging me to use the card again. Once they even gave me $50 in credit if I'd just spend $200 on it.



Even if I needed a new truck, market conditions are still terrible. Something new comparable to what I have now would be about $25k more than what I paid in 2017. Toyota full size trucks with their new hybrid power train are even MORE expensive ($70+ for a half ton?). If i had to buy something now, I'd probably try to find a low mileage I-Force V8 Tundra.


I can't put my finger on what triggers my bias against gm's midsize SUVs, Blazer and Traverse, etc. Just uninspiring, nothing exceptional, I suppose. If I needed a new car, I'd probably look at a new Mazda6 or Toyota Crown, unless I came across some gonga deal on something comparable.

[olrocker]

Originally Posted by Capricio

I used to funnel all my monthly expenses (cell phone, electric, trash, etc) through my GM rewards card is 4% return is one of the best return rates out there, if you're going spend it on a gm vehicle.


After dumping about 5 years worth of accumulated balance into my Camaro purchase (and the dealer let me put about $4K on my gm rewards card yielding 7% that I paid off immediately), I gradually came to realize that unless my truck were destroyed (only 40k miles on a 2017), there is nothing left in the gm portfolio that I want.



Every car I have owned, my entire life, has been from gm. So, this was kind of pivotal for me. I didn't cancel the card but I transitioned all my expenses to a different cash back card that pays out a lower rate with no categories. The balance from the Camaro purchase is just sitting there. Every once in a while I get a spam email from Goldman-Sachs encouraging me to use the card again. Once they even gave me $50 in credit if I'd just spend $200 on it.



Even if I needed a new truck, market conditions are still terrible. Something new comparable to what I have now would be about $25k more than what I paid in 2017. Toyota full size trucks with their new hybrid power train are even MORE expensive ($70+ for a half ton?). If i had to buy something now, I'd probably try to find a low mileage I-Force V8 Tundra.


I can't put my finger on what triggers my bias against gm's midsize SUVs, Blazer and Traverse, etc. Just uninspiring, nothing exceptional, I suppose. If I needed a new car, I'd probably look at a new Mazda6 or Toyota Crown, unless I came across some gonga deal on something comparable.

I pretty much did the same thing. I used all my points on the Camaro (I’ve had my GM card since 2001) but with the switch to Goldman-Sachs they changed the savings/discount parameters as well as the fact they just don’t have anything I’m interested in either. So I still have the card but haven’t touched it since Sept. I got a Citibank double cash with 2% cash back in everything, all the time.