A post I was hoping to not have to make (GM blocks L3 engine warranty repair) - Page 32 - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

Jc's1LE · 05-15-2016, 06:48 PM

So i guess catch cans can blow your motor WOW LMAO !!! I showed this thread to a couple of my friends and they said thats GM for ya anything to screw ya over. I wont be upgrading to a 2017 1LE

PDXSSCE · 05-15-2016, 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HeaterMan

something doesn't seem right here.. all is not as is stated or appears. nobody who is that much in the right gives up that easily.. nobody

I too feel there's something missing from the story.

MrChrisLS3 · 05-15-2016, 07:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by motorhead

And thus why I'm done with GM unless they show proof as to the catch can being the cause of a pump failure. They don't deserve the money that I bust my ass to earn at this point.

This is that stage in the game when the customer files a lawsuit to contend GM's decision. Once it goes to court, it is at that point GM has to show where they determined the part caused the failure.

Now, the tricky aspect of this case, is that they blocked the warranty, and stopped the work before they discovered what the actual issue was. So, not knowing what actually failed, or what actually caused the failure, they may simply have to supply sufficient evidence that a catch can, or change to the PCV system could create loss of oil pressure. From what I read in the original post, we never really found out even if the oil pump did actually fail, much less what caused it. GM stopped the tear down.

I am not an expert on Magnuson Moss, but it seems to me that the consumer protection part of it is more about keeping manufacturers from gouging consumers on replacement parts. If not for this protection, for example, we might be required to replace the air filter with AC Delco, which they could charge an artificially inflated price for, and we would have to pay that or risk losing the warranty.

Adding some thing that modifies the structure or operation of a factory system, on the other hand, creates a situation where a manufacturer can deny warranty. This situation means that it is up to the consumer to prove that the failure was indeed a manufacture defect, and not caused by the modification to the factory engineered system.

Like I said, I'm no expert, but this appears to be where GM is drawing their line in the sand. Whether this is right or wrong, I guess depends on what side of that line you're standing on. Both sides have valid points.

I guess the lesson learned here is that if you are going to modify anything on your car, and still expect warranty coverage, talk with your service manager before making the jump. If they give you the A-Okay, then I might suggest taking the car to that dealer for any issues. Remember, this all started when a tech, at a non Chevrolet dealership had to put in a call to the T.A.C. because he wasn't sure either what the catch can was, or how to go about the repair. A mod friendly Chevrolet dealer wouldn't have needed to do this, and there wouldn't have been an issue. They would've just replaced the pump, charged it to warranty, and be done with it.

And of course, anyone who decides they will never buy GM again because of this case, is free to do so. However, there is no guarantee that any other manufacturer would handle this any differently.

Nor Cal ZL1 · 05-15-2016, 10:56 PM

This is still BS. I would buy and LSX, and drop ship the LS3 onto Mary Barra's lawn. GM will now replace my supercharger that is still good, but beginning to have the isolator rattle. Was going to just do it myself..... not anymore.

Phlip77 · 05-16-2016, 10:00 AM

Although it can happen with any other manufacturers, I think I will explore other options when update/upgrade time arrives.

The wife wants to get rid of her cobalt for an SUV or Crossover. And when my G8 is changed to garage queen status, there will not be another GM product added to the family.

Will I go back in the future, who knows but this pisses me off to no end. The price of automobiles today has risen substantially and some people have opted to finance the vehicles. When you buy a new vehicle, you come to expect it to be extremely reliable within the first cycle of its life. For F! sake, oil pump failure with less than 12,000Miles on it.

That being said, you add a part that you feel (and has proven) increases life span on the car. An unforeseen and apparently known issue occurs, GM takes this opportunity to void the warranty without even so much as a true diagnosis.

I really hope it's worth the 12k in savings for the repair, GM. As if even 5 people decide to opt out of another GM purchase, you do the math.

STL_G8GT · 05-16-2016, 10:22 AM

In the final post about the "resolution" the OP said "I understand and agree" multiple times. I find that odd... sounds pretty legalese to me, and carefully crafted.

qcman · 05-16-2016, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by STL_G8GT

In the final post about the "resolution" the OP said "I understand and agree" multiple times. I find that odd... sounds pretty legalese to me, and carefully crafted.

I interpret it differently the guy feels beaten and has no working reliable car. So he has to get it fixed somehow and carry on. If it were my DD I would do the same I suppose. Now if its a garage queen then I would be much more patient.

If there was some form of agreement he wouldn't have posted as he wouldn't be able to but he did saying he was SOL.

STL_G8GT · 05-16-2016, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by qcman

I interpret it differently the guy feels beaten and has no working reliable car. So he has to get it fixed somehow and carry on. If it were my DD I would do the same I suppose. Now if its a garage queen then I would be much more patient.

If there was some form of agreement he wouldn't have posted as he wouldn't be able to but he did saying he was SOL.

Fair enough. I've seen it mentioned that a case like this is a death knell to small mods and warranty coverage, but by the same token, any other outcome could open the floodgates the other direction.

I still can't grasp how they connect the addition of a catch can to the failure of the oil pump.

Sent from my LG-D800 using Tapatalk

xc_SS/RS · 05-16-2016, 10:37 AM

Surprised no one brought this up with SEMA and see what they say/recommend. Unless someone already did

FloridaBill · 05-16-2016, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SlingShot

Your interpretation is not correct. The FTC is talking about OE replacement parts, and NOT modifications. You modify your car, and you are on your own if anything breaks. When it comes to laws, there is more than just the words, there is also the intent.

I hope I never have to find out, but my only mod is a Chevy Performance Z/28 CAI. If my warranty was ever voided because of an OE upgrade part the shit is going to hit the fan.

qcman · 05-16-2016, 11:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by STL_G8GT

Fair enough. I've seen it mentioned that a case like this is a death knell to small mods and warranty coverage, but by the same token, any other outcome could open the floodgates the other direction.

I still can't grasp how they connect the addition of a catch can to the failure of the oil pump.

Sent from my LG-D800 using Tapatalk

I'm pretty sure the oil pump was not confirmed as the culprit though it is the likely one for sure. I think they just saw the CC in the photo, knew the car lost oil pressure, blamed the CC and halted everything right there.

I agree with you its a death knell to modded cars in here. A lot of folks have said they got warranty work done with mods but they weren't for a failed engine either so I think the severity of the situation here is unique as well. I think the CC being an additional part that was not part of the stock PCV system gave them a legal out in their minds hard to say though...

maddoggyusa · 05-16-2016, 11:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FloridaBill

I hope I never have to find out, but my only mod is a Chevy Performance Z/28 CAI. If my warranty was ever voided because of an OE upgrade part the shit is going to hit the fan.

lots of those "GM parts" can still void your warranty

FloridaBill · 05-16-2016, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maddoggyusa

lots of those "GM parts" can still void your warranty

I understand, and the Z/28 CAI is not recommended on the L99 but no such warning was made about the LS3. I'm not sure they would make a similar stand on one of their own parts as they did on an aftermarket catch can.

Like I said, I hope I never have to find out.

Scottiemac · 05-16-2016, 11:12 AM

Even with GM performance parts they are very specific on the parts that they say will not void your warranty "when installed by a GM authorized dealer" that's why my GM parts aren't on my car yet. I am a mechanic with 35yrs experience. I haven't decided if I'm installing them or paying the dealer. My dealer seems ok but do you take the chance? It's up to the individual. Still bad that GM wouldn't at least investigate the problem.

05-16-2016, 10:22 AM	#440
STL_G8GT Drives: 2009 Pontiac G8 GT Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Jefferson City Posts: 40	In the final post about the "resolution" the OP said "I understand and agree" multiple times. I find that odd... sounds pretty legalese to me, and carefully crafted. __________________ 2009 PBM G8 GT Pat G Non-DoD Cam, ARP Bits, DSteck/Shane Tuned, Magnacharger Chrome 2300 1:1, RCR Ported/Polished TB, Blower, & L92 Heads w/ LS3 intake valves, Comp Cams Trunion Upgrade Kit, ARH 1 7/8 catted to Hooker Maxflows, RotoFab, CTS-V PWM 1:1 fuel system, ID850 injectors Mike Norris Motorsports Catchcan, AEM 30-4100, JHP Boost/Fuel Gauge Pod TSW Nurburgring Matte Gray 18" w/Nitto 555 & 555R, Satin Black SS Brembo Fronts, BMR Trailing Arms, Pedders Sway Bars, Whiteline Bushings

05-16-2016, 10:37 AM	#443
xc_SS/RS Drives: 2010 Camaro SS/RS Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: somewhere in MD Posts: 4,883	Surprised no one brought this up with SEMA and see what they say/recommend. Unless someone already did __________________ 2010 2SS/RS Z/28 intake, NW, FAST 102, speed engineering LT's, some exhaust, ATI -10% pulley, GM flex fuel injectors, DSX flex fuel sensor, MGW shifter, HP Tuners, some suspension work, stickers and a little weight loss. 12.63 @113.53

05-15-2016, 06:48 PM	#435
Jc's1LE Drives: 2015 SW 1LE BA NPP Recaros Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: lake mary FL Posts: 904	So i guess catch cans can blow your motor WOW LMAO !!! I showed this thread to a couple of my friends and they said thats GM for ya anything to screw ya over. I wont be upgrading to a 2017 1LE

05-15-2016, 10:56 PM	#438
Nor Cal ZL1 Drives: 2013 ZL1 M6 Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Nor Cal Posts: 1,825	This is still BS. I would buy and LSX, and drop ship the LS3 onto Mary Barra's lawn. GM will now replace my supercharger that is still good, but beginning to have the isolator rattle. Was going to just do it myself..... not anymore.

05-16-2016, 10:00 AM	#439
Phlip77 Drives: 2009 Pontiac G8 GT Join Date: Dec 2015 Location: Kitchener, Ontario Posts: 3	Although it can happen with any other manufacturers, I think I will explore other options when update/upgrade time arrives. The wife wants to get rid of her cobalt for an SUV or Crossover. And when my G8 is changed to garage queen status, there will not be another GM product added to the family. Will I go back in the future, who knows but this pisses me off to no end. The price of automobiles today has risen substantially and some people have opted to finance the vehicles. When you buy a new vehicle, you come to expect it to be extremely reliable within the first cycle of its life. For F! sake, oil pump failure with less than 12,000Miles on it. That being said, you add a part that you feel (and has proven) increases life span on the car. An unforeseen and apparently known issue occurs, GM takes this opportunity to void the warranty without even so much as a true diagnosis. I really hope it's worth the 12k in savings for the repair, GM. As if even 5 people decide to opt out of another GM purchase, you do the math.

05-16-2016, 11:12 AM	#448
Scottiemac Drives: Black 2015 1ss/rs Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: Philadelphia Posts: 354	Even with GM performance parts they are very specific on the parts that they say will not void your warranty "when installed by a GM authorized dealer" that's why my GM parts aren't on my car yet. I am a mechanic with 35yrs experience. I haven't decided if I'm installing them or paying the dealer. My dealer seems ok but do you take the chance? It's up to the individual. Still bad that GM wouldn't at least investigate the problem.