[hzycamaro]

Hi, I just found the inner edge of front tires is worn out while the outer edge still has some left. I'll put some pictures below.

The tire is Toyo R888R and camber is -1.5. With this set of tires, the car had 5500 street miles, 4 track days (6-7 hours track time) and 6 autocross. This tire has a treadwear rating of 100 so I guess it's normal that it's done after all these miles.

It's worth mentioning that I'm beginner on track so probably I was not driving very fast on track (If you have driven on Buttonwillow, my best Buttonwillow 13cw time is 1:05:xx so you can have an idea of my level and speed on track and I was slower than this on the 1st and 2nd track day)

I have a few questions:
1. This is uneven wear, right? I'm not experienced in working on cars so I have to confirm this. I didn't notice the inner edge wear at all until a mechanic told me this yesterday. I was only looking at the wear indicator on the side wall (the small triangle) for tire wear
2. The front tires need to be replaced ASAP, right?
3. Rear tires have -1.25 camber but it doesn't have such obvious uneven wear. By my visual check, inner and outer edges have similar life on it. Or at least, both edges still have tread on it.
4. How can I fix it? Reduce the front camber? I thought -1.5 is not enough.
5. Previously I asked questions about tires and many experienced drivers here suggested me to use max summer performance tires (such as RE-71R) in stead of R compound tires as beginner and I'm gonna follow it. Now with front tires worn out, can I replace only front tires or should I replace all 4 tires?

Thanks!

[hzycamaro]

Pictures can be viewed here:
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1SF...4i2Hhk8-O7d5zp
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1wp...ba2dvYfT0IfzxC
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1sK...C2rXA1nl2Kr1su

How can I insert pictures here?

[baron95]

First that is not bad wear at all - I'd be super happy if my tires looked like that after 4 track days and that many miles/autocrosses.

Second, if you liked how those tires handle on track, and how much they lasted, keep using them - they are good tires. Some track day folks seem to think that "R compound" (whatever they think that means) require some supernatural skill to handle. There is no such thing.

R888s are honest, consistent tires. And consistency throughout a session is key. RE71Rs are good tires also, so no harm in trying them. But don't believe for a second that you have to move away from R888s because they are "R compound".

As to alignment....if you track regularly, I would not recommend less that -1.5 camber up front. I would check your toe, make sure it is dialed in, and leave camber alone.

The fact that you are not shredding the outside shoulder of the front tires is actually a very good sign that you are doing many things right. Many beginner drivers understeer their way through corners and wear the outside shoulder. You must be doing a proper slow-in fast out, with less steering and more throttle from apex out. Congrats.

Good luck. And keep at it.

[hzycamaro]

baron95, thank you for your reply!

Originally Posted by baron95

First that is not bad wear at all - I'd be super happy if my tires looked like that after 4 track days and that many miles/autocrosses.

Really? That's great! The inner edge is almost bald so I thought it's worn out. In this case how do I know if it's worn out or there is uneven wear?

Originally Posted by baron95

Second, if you liked how those tires handle on track, and how much they lasted, keep using them - they are good tires. Some track day folks seem to think that "R compound" (whatever they think that means) require some supernatural skill to handle. There is no such thing.

R888s are honest, consistent tires. And consistency throughout a session is key. RE71Rs are good tires also, so no harm in trying them. But don't believe for a second that you have to move away from R888s because they are "R compound".

I do like the handling of this tire on track but I have no comparison since this is the only tire I have used on track.

Originally Posted by baron95

As to alignment....if you track regularly, I would not recommend less that -1.5 camber up front. I would check your toe, make sure it is dialed in, and leave camber alone.

I guess I'll keep camber -1.5 for now. As for toe, as far as I can remember, it's 1/32 toe in.

Originally Posted by baron95

The fact that you are not shredding the outside shoulder of the front tires is actually a very good sign that you are doing many things right. Many beginner drivers understeer their way through corners and wear the outside shoulder. You must be doing a proper slow-in fast out, with less steering and more throttle from apex out. Congrats.

Glad to hear your compliment. Thanks!

[baron95]

I don't have an SS with FE3 suspension, so someone else may be better equipped to answer your toe question.

In general it seems like very slight toe in, i.e. 0.1deg total toe (L+R), works well for Gen6 Camaros. That is what I set my alignment to. My first track day will be on Friday, I'll let you know how I like it, but I have the 1LE suspension - SS FE3 may be a bit different.

As far as wear, from the pictures, looks like the tire is at the wear bars on the outside, and the insides are worn but not corded or anything. If you had done one extra track day, you might have come out even across the tire's face. That is why I'm saying it is not bad. Beats the alternative of junking a track tire because it wore out the outside shoulder.

[hzycamaro]

Originally Posted by baron95

As far as wear, from the pictures, looks like the tire is at the wear bars on the outside, and the insides are worn but not corded or anything. If you had done one extra track day, you might have come out even across the tire's face. That is why I'm saying it is not bad. Beats the alternative of junking a track tire because it wore out the outside shoulder.

If it's at the wear bar, I need to replace front tires now, is it right? Can I go to another track day with current front tires? Could you tell me if I should replace front tires now? If not now, when to replace them? Thanks

[Norm Peterson]

Does the entity putting on your track days have any tech sheet requirements other than "no cord showing"? I'm assuming that there's no need to consider the possibility of your next track day being wet. But do check them for cording or almost-cording after every session, around the entire circumference.


The cautions against running R-compounds early in your HPDE driver development is that their extra grip can let you pick up bad habits and their breakaway characteristics can be a bit more abrupt. But going off Baron's comments, you're apparently managing to avoid those on your own.


Norm

[hzycamaro]

Originally Posted by Norm Peterson

Does the entity putting on your track days have any tech sheet requirements other than "no cord showing"? I'm assuming that there's no need to consider the possibility of your next track day being wet. But do check them for cording or almost-cording after every session, around the entire circumference.

Thanks, Norm. I'll do another track day with current tires and check for cording after every session.

I ran with NASA and a local group. NASA did tech inspection and I forget their requirement for tread depth. But they didn't inspect tire or only took a look at the outside edge. That local group doesn't do tech inspection (They say it's your responsibility). So it really depends on me.

Originally Posted by Norm Peterson

The cautions against running R-compounds early in your HPDE driver development is that their extra grip can let you pick up bad habits and their breakaway characteristics can be a bit more abrupt. But going off Baron's comments, you're apparently managing to avoid those on your own.

You and other people mentioned this idea in another thread I posted a few months ago and I really appreciate it. I plan to try another tire. Front tires wear faster than rear tires but I assume it's not a good idea to run different tires for the front and rear. What do you think?

[Norm Peterson]

Different tires can have different breakaway characteristics, different limits, different rates of achieving optimum temperature, even a different mix between cornering and acceleration/braking grips.

I've seen "different tires" carried to a truly stupid extreme at autocross, with a truly unpleasant result at what was probably a sub-40 mph speed. Scary thing is that it was pretty obvious why they had done it, and that tech inspection apparently had no basis for sending it back to paddock to get it corrected.


Norm