[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by crysalis_01

And wasn't there also talk about GM holding Camaro7 until after S650 debuts?

Honestly, the whole jumping to conclusions regarding the "cancelation" of Camaro was ridiculous. I'll see if I can find the statement about them waiting.

I wonder if that means they'll hold off till MY 2027... that seems crazy, especially seeing as Camaro would seem to provide the "volume" for the platform.

Don’t waste your time looking for that information. You are dealing with a person who has a one note song. Because ONE VARIANT OF MUSTANG GT is faster than all variants of Camaro SS he just tries to continue to sing that song to get under the skin of Camaro6 in general, hotlap and BlaqWhole in particular. He ignores the fact that the typical GT on dealer lots ARE NOT so equipped and he ignores the fact that the M6 GT in any form is looking at the taillights of any Camaro SS, thus making it the slowest of the V8 pony cars. I’m excluding Challenger 5.7L R/T. The Mustang GT PP1 A10 (hotlap has dubbed this version GT*) is wicked fast, no doubt. Actually, all V8 Mustangs and Camaros are, but that’s not really the point. The point is that we all acknowledge that GT* is the fastest non-FI pony car. But this particular person feels the need to infer that ALL GTs are now lifted onto the same pedestal. OK.

[Lafourche1]

I think the GT500 is a good thing. Any car that brings more folks into dealerships is a good thing. The ZR1 did some of that for GM.

The criteria for the success of the GT500 may be a bit more complex. If the GT500 base model is faster in a straight line than the "base" ZL1, that is one thing (Chrysler has that one trick pony, too). If the base GT500 is faster around Big Willow, VIR and The Green Hell, that is very much another thing. If the base GT500 is both of those things, for $5K more, then that is a real thing. If it is $20K more, then it needs to be faster in those things that the Z06/Z07 package Vette (my opinion - not fact).

If the base GT500 is not faster around the above tracks than the ZLE then that is a thing, too. If the CFTP GT500 is not faster around the above tracks than the ZLE, then that is a big thing. Once again, these are my opinions, not fact.

I am curious, do we have any magazine times for the 10A SS around VIR, etc. and in the 0-60 / standing quarter mile? Just haven't seen anything in my feeds (yes, I know the A10 in the SS is not the same as in the ZL1).

[Ethanolic]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

Post #1501 in this same thread on 04-06-2019 at 09:52 PM. You're losing track of your lies. That seems to happen with fake little racer boys who buzz around my town all the time.

I stand corrected it was twice. As far as fake little racer boys goes... I’m confident I can post more time slips from this year alone than you can post from your lifetime. Care to wager?

[Ethanolic]

Originally Posted by Evansa22

All I can say after reading thru many of these pages is this, any mustang fans in here talking trash probably should try to get a life. This was a discussion about the new ford gt500 and the fact that you're in here trolling says to me you should probably get a life. Maybe take up some hobbies or other constructive activities in life, I barely have enough time or energy to check out and comment on forums about a car that I own. And love to own. I can only see the driving force behind your trash talking as jealousy. Maybe head back to your own corner and boost each others self esteem, or dont, nobody here really cares. To add to the discussion I thought you'd be able to get a carbon track pack gt500 for 95k otd. Guess that figures out the window now that msrp for it is about 95k. Does carbon fiber cost that much? I'm just wondering if anyone here can justify the price they have set on these things, thanks

It’s worth it to the people who can afford it or that’s Fords thinking, if they are wrong they will adjust the price of the options in year 2. They aren’t stupid, they have seen what people are willing to spend for comparable performance.

[newmoon]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

Don’t waste your time looking for that information. You are dealing with a person who has a one note song. Because ONE VARIANT OF MUSTANG GT is faster than all variants of Camaro SS he just tries to continue to sing that song to get under the skin of Camaro6 in general, hotlap and BlaqWhole in particular. He ignores the fact that the typical GT on dealer lots ARE NOT so equipped and he ignores the fact that the M6 GT in any form is looking at the taillights of any Camaro SS, thus making it the slowest of the V8 pony cars. I’m excluding Challenger 5.7L R/T. The Mustang GT PP1 A10 (hotlap has dubbed this version GT*) is wicked fast, no doubt. Actually, all V8 Mustangs and Camaros are, but that’s not really the point. The point is that we all acknowledge that GT* is the fastest non-FI pony car. But this particular person feels the need to infer that ALL GTs are now lifted onto the same pedestal. OK.

Spin this anyway you like but presently you can walk into a Ford Dealership and purchase a Mustang GT that is quicker and faster in the 60', 1/4 mile, and top-end than any version of the SS that is available. If you want to hang your hat on well my slower trim model is faster than your slower trim model have fun.

[Deki]

Originally Posted by TheRealJA105

Is this thread about cars or about people being snowflakes???

Hey! I live in Arizona and we don't get too much snow, so I find that offensive! On a serious note, this thread went sideways a long time ago. I bet if these two actually met in person they would find out they have a common love for V8 sports cars and they wouldn't be arguing over stupid shit.

[Chadicus]

Originally Posted by newmoon

Spin this anyway you like but presently you can walk into a Ford Dealership and purchase a Mustang GT that is quicker and faster in the 60', 1/4 mile, and top-end than any version of the SS that is available. If you want to hang your hat on well my slower trim model is faster than your slower trim model have fun.

Stock Mustangs are limited to 165 I believe. Lol. Camaros are not. Also we have seen the A8 and A10 Camaros run high 11s. Cars.com has not run a Camaro yet so I'll give you the .1 second over the A10 SS. Also .1 over the M6 SS. Grats? The Mustang GT* lost to a Kia on an unprepped surface so there is that also. So keep hanging your hat on the one set of options that on a prepped surface beat a M6 SS (and A10) by .1 seconds yet managed to lose to a Kia when there was no prep.

[Laststandard]

Originally Posted by newmoon

Spin this anyway you like but presently you can walk into a Ford Dealership and purchase a Mustang GT that is quicker and faster in the 60', 1/4 mile, and top-end than any version of the SS that is available. If you want to hang your hat on well my slower trim model is faster than your slower trim model have fun.

Not if I want an M6..

[IneedAZ]

This will take care of the GT vs SS debate if GM would get off their ass and release it. They keep teasing us at Sema. First an SS then the ZL1 Drag car. OK, how about some production. I am ready to buy one.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by newmoon

Spin this anyway you like but presently you can walk into a Ford Dealership and purchase a Mustang GT that is quicker and faster in the 60', 1/4 mile, and top-end than any version of the SS that is available. If you want to hang your hat on well my slower trim model is faster than your slower trim model have fun.

As I have proven before, you cannot just walk into any dealership within a 25 mile radius of Ford World HQ or the Flat Rock plant where Mustang is built and find a GT*. Trying to remember my own numbers, because they’re buried so deep in this or another thread that I don’t feel like searching for them....but out of almost 30 Mustang GT PP1 cars I could find on dealer lots in the described territory, only 4 or 5 were GT*. Anybody can ORDER one and I’m sure people who know do that. But the casual buyer walking into the dealership off the street is NOT going to get a GT*. They’ll get a GT, which is nice, and is a driver’s race with any Camaro SS. Or, heaven forbid, they’ll get an M6 GT and trail the pack.

[Evansa22]

Good point Martin. I wholeheartedly agree with you, 74k for that car even as a base model I believe to be a fair price considering the competition. Whether or not people will be able to get them for that price, we will have to wait and see. If the past is an indicator then no, but that's speculation until they hit the dealers. Still waiting on the weight of the different models but if it's what we're thinking, around 4100lbs, then I'd consider it closer to the hellcat redeye widebody purely based on weight and hp rating. Venom kills demons or something like that. If it can top the zl1 at that weight then I would consider it a great job, even though the zl1 isn't that much lighter.
Ethanolic, I never thought ford was stupid. Someone spending 25k adm may be though. However spend your money as you see fit, i sure do. Just wondering the logic behind the pricing, vague answer as you put it would be the free market.

[BlaqWhole]

Ok but let's all remember that IF the B-GT500 can beat the ZL1 in the quarter mile and IF it can also beat it around a track then you're still comparing a $74K vehicle to a $64K vehicle. So the question would then be how much does it beat the ZL1 by and IF it can beat other vehicles that cost $74K MSRP. ALso what I want to know is if it would be fair to compare the Z06 to the GT500. At a MSRP of $80K, the Z06 is closer in price to the GT500 than the GT500 is to the ZL1. So it still would stand that Ford cannot build anything comparably priced to the ZL1 that can beat the ZL1 at anything.

And not only that but one could argue how much a GT500 would cost if it was optioned comparably to the ZL1. So if someone wanted a GT500 because it could beat a ZL1 but they also wanted heat/cooled seats, heated steering wheel, Nav, blind spot indicators, and other options, on a ZL1 you would still be under $70K and still cheaper than a bare bones base GT500 by a significant amount. Now what would the GT500 cost when optioned similarly?

We all know the CF version will be over $100K when optioned.

So in light of what the competition costs, is it worth $80K+ (base) and $100K+ just to say you can beat a standard ZL1 (at $64K base or under $70K fully optioned) and a ZLE (at $72K or around $75K with options)? And at $74K MSRP, shouldn't the base GT500 be able to beat the ZLE around the track instead of just the ZL1? It seems to me that you're paying a lot of money just to have a car that can beat a much cheaper car at something.

So is it still worth it in that respect?

[hotlap]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

Don’t waste your time looking for that information. You are dealing with a person who has a one note song. Because ONE VARIANT OF MUSTANG GT is faster than all variants of Camaro SS he just tries to continue to sing that song to get under the skin of Camaro6 in general, hotlap and BlaqWhole in particular. He ignores the fact that the typical GT on dealer lots ARE NOT so equipped and he ignores the fact that the M6 GT in any form is looking at the taillights of any Camaro SS, thus making it the slowest of the V8 pony cars. I’m excluding Challenger 5.7L R/T. The Mustang GT PP1 A10 (hotlap has dubbed this version GT*) is wicked fast, no doubt. Actually, all V8 Mustangs and Camaros are, but that’s not really the point. The point is that we all acknowledge that GT* is the fastest non-FI pony car. But this particular person feels the need to infer that ALL GTs are now lifted onto the same pedestal. OK.

In this latest round, we were discussing the GT350R losing to the base ZL1 despite having the advantage of...

• Application specific 8,250 rpm, 526 HP, 429 lb-ft flat plane crank engine
• 245 lb weight advantage
• Carbon fiber wheels that reduce rotating mass -60 lb
• Rear seat delete
• 305 front, 315 rear Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2 (285/305 GY on the ZL1)
• First adaptation of the GM developed, magnetic ride system

They also followed Chevy and put a Tremec in it.


Relevant to this thread because the GT500 will have more power.

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by Ethanolic

I stand corrected it was twice. As far as fake little racer boys goes... I’m confident I can post more time slips from this year alone than you can post from your lifetime. Care to wager?

Yea? And what do you race? Your "F150"?

That's a pretty dumb bet. I could rent a track with some friends 3 or 4 times and end up with 50 slips. However at another track I could go 10 times and have only 20 slips. So what does having more slips prove? My closest track is an hour and a half away from me. Which means 3 hours of my day spent driving there. So no, I don't go to the track. Plus it doesn't interest me in the slightest. I don't get paid to race my car. I have a ZL1 and a Hellcat. We all know how fast both cars are. That's enough for me.

Originally Posted by newmoon

Spin this anyway you like but presently you can walk into a Ford Dealership and purchase a Mustang GT that is quicker and faster in the 60', 1/4 mile, and top-end than any version of the SS that is available. If you want to hang your hat on well my slower trim model is faster than your slower trim model have fun.

I get your point and I do agree that if the goal was to have the absolute best quarter mile between the GT and SS, then you can walk into a Ford dealership and buy a GT that would be faster than any SS stock for stock and based on magazine times. I also believe than the Mustang GT is a better quarter mile vehicle than the Camaro SS. But to me the thing is that with the GT you can either get one with very high marks in the quarter mile (GT*) or one with very good track capabilities (GT PP2) but not both. The quarter mile version will suck around a track. The track version will suck at the quarter mile. However with the Camaro you are getting a car that although it is not the best in one area, it also does not suck in any area. The SS A8 is great in a straight line AND good around a track. The SLE is great around a track AND good in a straight line. If you gave points to each car, the GT would have higher points in one area or another depending on the trim while the SS would have more points when you tally them all together in any trim.