January 2014 Camaro Sales Figures (and vs. Mustang & Challenger)

[edco]

Originally Posted by hunttriumph1500

I expected Challenger sales to be quite low with all the hype in the last 2 years about the new 2015 Challenger refresh coming out on 22 March of this year. Oh and that new HellCat Hemi is worth noting too. I am not sure why folks keep saying the Challenger is so heavy when in fact my 2SS Camaro is only 150 lbs lighter than my SRT8 Challenger. I weighed them both, but my Bullitt Mustang is lighter still than the Camaro by almost 475 lbs!! The Camaro needs to lose some weight too!

It is cool to see your post. Your opinion about the relative merits of the three muscle cars carries some weight. You bought them all! If you had to downsize and sell two, what do you keep?

[Angrybird 12]

Originally Posted by edco

It is cool to see your post. Your opinion about the relative merits of the three muscle cars carries some weight. You bought them all! If you had to downsize and sell two, what do you keep?

You wouldn't put a feller on the spot, would you?

[edco]

Originally Posted by Q'smuscle

Hey, the Dodge and Chevy needs to pick on someone its own size! lmao.... looks like the mustang was getting bullied!

Hi Q. Wish you a good new year. I got my stang rolling just twice in the last 60 days. I did not swap back to the factory Pirelli all season wheel set, and left the summer 275/40R18s on for the winter. With all the snow and ice the pony stays in the garage. It needs to be in the forties to drive summer tires and I don't like salt and slop on my GT.

You feeling good about sales numbers, and should. How about a little big picture here. Mustang is in the tenth year of a platform generation. It has stood 5 years sales competition against the later date entry, more advanced Camaro. The 2015 stang is 9 months away. The S197 production ends in June. It does not figure mustang will lead. Will Camaro stand five years competition against a later date entry more advanced Mustang. No! Oshawa is planned for shut down now, and GM is trying to hold their exposure to competing with a later date entry mustang to one year. That is good sales strategy but expensive. Ford made money with S197 and they will make money with the S550 platform. Ford has always been committed to the Pony car: FoxBody-ten years, S95-ten Years, S-197 ten years, on to S550.
If Camaro sales stay at 5000 a month the gen5 will not reach 500,000.
S-197 is over a million for ten years. Do apples to apples: if gen 5 Camaro stayed on the market for ten years, what do the next five years look like?
I speculate not to a million. Camaro believes the world began in April 2009 and holds the lead in that time slot. The new and later entry date model factor counts for something. It has been advantage Camaro-5 years. Come fall 2014 it will be advantage Mustang. If Camaro sat on gen 5 for five more years, what happens? GM ain't going to find out. I don't blame them. Hey, I like your car, my car and the guy above who has all thee. Good Luck! Edco

[edco]

Originally Posted by 87GNX

Ive seen it twice and still think it's uglier everytime I look at it.

Went to the Jan 2014 STL, MO auto show. Saw the 15 stang in person.
Looked at everything. Do you think a Camaro is pretty?
I still plan to buy a 14 close out stang for the bang for buck incentive.
However, looking at the 15 stang was a kick. If that is ugly look at the camaro some more.

[bandit38]

Originally Posted by 31B

I don't know the exact number, but I believe at 1 time FBOD Father said 67% of all sales were V6's.

Thanks, I appreciate you posting that, I've always wondered.

[bandit38]

Originally Posted by edco

Went to the Jan 2014 STL, MO auto show. Saw the 15 stang in person.
Looked at everything. Do you think a Camaro is pretty? I still plan to buy a 14 close out stang for the bang for buck incentive. However, looking at the 15 stang was a kick. If that is ugly look at the camaro some more.

It does look better every time I see it.....I wonder looking at how round the roof is if they will offer any type of Sunroof.

[wayne watson]

Originally Posted by edco

Went to the Jan 2014 STL, MO auto show. Saw the 15 stang in person.
Looked at everything. Do you think a Camaro is pretty? I still plan to buy a 14 close out stang for the bang for buck incentive. However, looking at the 15 stang was a kick. If that is ugly look at the camaro some more.

that rear end looked better back when they called it fairmont

[Q'smuscle]

Originally Posted by edco

Hi Q. Wish you a good new year. I got my stang rolling just twice in the last 60 days. I did not swap back to the factory Pirelli all season wheel set, and left the summer 275/40R18s on for the winter. With all the snow and ice the pony stays in the garage. It needs to be in the forties to drive summer tires and I don't like salt and slop on my GT.

You feeling good about sales numbers, and should. How about a little big picture here. Mustang is in the tenth year of a platform generation. It has stood 5 years sales competition against the later date entry, more advanced Camaro. The 2015 stang is 9 months away. The S197 production ends in June. It does not figure mustang will lead. Will Camaro stand five years competition against a later date entry more advanced Mustang. No! Oshawa is planned for shut down now, and GM is trying to hold their exposure to competing with a later date entry mustang to one year. That is good sales strategy but expensive. Ford made money with S197 and they will make money with the S550 platform. Ford has always been committed to the Pony car: FoxBody-ten years, S95-ten Years, S-197 ten years, on to S550.
If Camaro sales stay at 5000 a month the gen6 will not reach 500,000.
S-197 is over a million for ten years. Do apples to apples: if gen 6 Camaro stayed on the market for ten years, what do the next five years look like?
I speculate not to a million. Camaro believes the world began in April 2009 and holds the lead in that time slot. The new and later entry date model factor counts for something. It has been advantage Camaro-5 years. Come fall 2014 it will be advantage Mustang. If Camaro sat on gen 6 for five more years, what happens? GM ain't going to find out. I don't blame them. Hey, I like your car, my car and the guy above who has all thee. Good Luck! Edco

Wow! Who was talking about sales? ?????? I was talking about the garage picture! You're also not being fair with sales because the mustang did half of it's 10 years without any competition! So if it was the camaro that came out first the camaro would most likely still be winning because the camaro is winning with competition! So imagine if the camarcould have the same luxury as the mustang did by not having any competition. The Camaro would be doing better . Also, the mustang changed , added HP , and added different models to the mustang line up. So even though the chassis was basically the same for 10 years, their was still a lot of changes with the car over those years. The camaro could still do good numbers how it is , If you consider the mustang numbers right now . Thanx for compliment! BTW I like the 13-14 mustang's and the more Retro 06-10's.

[Q'smuscle]

Originally Posted by edco

Went to the Jan 2014 STL, MO auto show. Saw the 15 stang in person.
Looked at everything. Do you think a Camaro is pretty? I still plan to buy a 14 close out stang for the bang for buck incentive. However, looking at the 15 stang was a kick. If that is ugly look at the camaro some more.

What year camaro are you talking about? ?? You need to be specific! The new 15 mustang looks like a Honda accord coupe from the side! That's definitely not a Fastback!

[edco]

Originally Posted by wayne watson

that rear end looked better back when they called it fairmont

This pic has as much to do with your post as a fairmont to 2015 stang.
Anyway:
It is my 07 GT axle coming back from Danny Miller Rear Gears with a 3.73
ring and pinion and non-crush sleeve seal. earlier I put a detroit true trac
helical diff in it. Miller sets up tons of NASCAR Ford 9" rears,
problem is he only handles axles-not cars. So you have to extract the axle.
Fairmonts are fox bodies, if they run the 8.8" rear like the foxes, with non-stock engine they are
nothing to snicker at. Modified Must & Fast Fords featured a 10 flat fairmont.
How many vegas can hold up to that?

[edco]

Originally Posted by Q'smuscle

Wow! Who was talking about sales? ?????? I was talking about the garage picture! You're also not being fair with sales because the mustang did half of it's 10 years without any competition! So if it was the camaro that came out first the camaro would most likely still be winning because the camaro is winning with competition! So imagine if the camarcould have the same luxury as the mustang did by not having any competition. The Camaro would be doing better . Also, the mustang changed , added HP , and added different models to the mustang line up. So even though the chassis was basically the same for 10 years, their was still a lot of changes with the car over those years. The camaro could still do good numbers how it is , If you consider the mustang numbers right now . Thanx for compliment! BTW I like the 13-14 mustang's and the more Retro 06-10's.

Q. Sorry I misread your post. However, you make good points about the sales.
There is another side to the coin. GM came back to muscle cars because S197 did 350,000 units in two model years. The Hertz, Shelby, Saleen, Rousch, Steeda, State Police, FR500C-race, and Cobra-jet fleet sales are not included in dealer statistics. Ford was having fun.

Camaro took along time to respond. Two years longer than Dodge. They made a great car and I knew it would be popular and thought they would sell more. We don't know how many Cams would sell if there were no Stangs. If there were no stangs the direction of the Cam may have been different. GM had a fixed target to shoot at. GM buys competitor vehicles cuts them in cross sections and builds to better the competition. That is why I wrote Camaro is a landmark in muscle car history for a base vehicle with 400+HP.

When Camaro entered, the S197 market was saturated. I wrote this prior, everyone who wanted one had one. Tip of the cap to your point about the sheet metal refresh, 3.7L, and coyote 5.0L 2011 engines. Nothing stops GM from doing a badly needed interior redesign and more Camaro specific engine options on the 5gen to stretch the Oshawa tooling to 2019. But GM pulled the plug on Oshawa and they know something you don't, they designated 5gen Camaro a lame duck.

They are following mustang to lighter, more euro, more eco. Who is driving this train? GM or Ford?

The S197 mid run refresh: as long as the 8.8" rear axle, sub-frames, control arms, floor pans, wheel base, roof, glass and other are the same, to me all ten years are the same car.

[wayne watson]

Originally Posted by edco

This pic has as much to do with your post as a fairmont to 2015 stang.
Anyway:
It is my 07 GT axle coming back from Danny Miller Rear Gears with a 3.73
ring and pinion and non-crush sleeve seal. earlier I put a detroit true trac
helical diff in it. Miller setups tons of NASCAR Ford 9" rears, problem is he only handles axles-not cars. So you have to extract the axle. Fairmonts are fox bodies, if they run the 8.8" rear like the foxes, with non-stock engine they are
nothing to snicker at. Modified Must & Fast Fords featured a 10 flat fairmont.
How many vegas can hold up to that?

never raced a vega, used to run outlaw 10.5 with yenko stripped nova with 632 inc motor and 9 inch rear. unfortunately cost of doing so forced a early retirement. noboby's laughing at your stuff just saying the 15 mustang rear would make a nice motorcycle ramp

[Q'smuscle]

Originally Posted by edco

Q. Sorry I misread your post. However, you make good points about the sales.
There is another side to the coin. GM came back to muscle cars because S197 did 350,000 units in two model years. The Hertz, Shelby, Saleen, Rousch, Steeda, State Police, FR500C-race, and Cobra-jet fleet sales are not included in dealer statistics. Ford was having fun.

Camaro took along time to respond. Two years longer than Dodge. They made a great car and I knew it would be popular and thought they would sell more.
We don't know how many Cams would sell if there were no Stangs. If there were no stangs the direction of the Cam may have been different. GM had a fixed target to shoot at. GM buys competitor vehicles cuts them in cross sections and builds to better the competition. That is why I wrote camaro is a landmark in muscle car history for a base vehicle with 400+HP.

When Camaro entered, the S197 market was saturated. I wrote this prior, everyone who wanted one had one. Tip of the cap to your point about the sheet metal refresh, 3.7L, and coyote 5.0L 2011 engines. Nothing stops GM from doing a badly needed interior redesign and more Camaro specific engine options on the 5gen to stretch the Oshuwa tooling to 2019. But GM pulled the plug on Oshuwa and they know something you don't, they designated 5gen Camaro a lame duck.

They are following mustang to lighter, more euro, more eco. Who is driving this train? GM or Ford?

The S197 mid run refresh: as long as that 8.8" rear axle, same sub-frames, same control arms, same floor pans, same wheel base, same roof, same glass
and other, to me all ten years are the same car.

LOL.. GM doesn't consider the 5th Gens that we all own lame ducks! Hence ... why they said that they're not going to go totally away from the 5th Gen designed because great success the 5th was ! The only reason GM is startting on the 6th Gen and stopping the 5th is to go lighter ! Nomatter what Ford has had no competition for the 1LE and now nothing for the z/28. Ford only has the Ford company , Chevy is a GM brand! So ofcourse, Ford has nothing else or any other obligations but to focus on their only sports car.

Chevy has two cars ! So first things first is the Corvette than the camaro! And it's funny because it kinda seems like. GM is driving the train now because look the mustang have a lot of the camaro exterior! Well the 2015 does! Nomatter what the 60's mustangs liked like they didn't go for that big rear fenders and roof reverse Mohawk until after the camaro camaro back with it. In 2006 , Ford was driving the train because they started this!

[edco]

Originally Posted by Q'smuscle

LOL.. GM doesn't consider the 5th Gens that we all own lame ducks! Hence ... why they said that they're not going to go totally away from the 5th Gen designed because great success the 5th was ! The only reason GM is startting on the 6th Gen and stopping the 5th is to go lighter ! Nomatter what Ford has had no competition for the 1LE and now nothing for the z/28. Ford only has the Ford company , Chevy is a GM brand! So ofcourse, Ford has nothing else or any other obligations but to focus on their only sports car.

Chevy has two cars ! So first things first is the Corvette than the camaro! And it's funny because it kinda seems like. GM is driving the train now because look the mustang have a lot of the camaro exterior! Well the 2015 does! Nomatter what the 60's mustangs liked like they didn't go for that big rear fenders and roof reverse Mohawk until after the camaro camaro back with it. In 2006 , Ford was driving the train because they started this!

OK, I will not argue with that. Those are good observations. I am glad you pointed out something that I have been reluctant to. When I look at the 2015 Mustang coupe I see definite resemblance to the gen 5 Camaro. You hit on everything I see. The rear fenders, the roof treatment, the front profile, all suggest Camaro lines to me, but I have kept quiet. I think you are right on Q. I see what you see. Camaro not only set a bar for power, I think the styling gets on the Muscle car landmark list also.