[Texas1ss]

Originally Posted by LancevanceZLE

Please read the existing threads on this issue. There are literally thousands of posts explaining this.

Please carry your frustration in people discussing key FOBs in a thread actually entitled "Class Action Lawsuit For Easily Hackable Keyfobs" elsewhere.

Thanks.

[Texas1ss]

Originally Posted by SS_Don

This thread has gone way off topic. If you are interested in security measures there are plenty of other threads that address how to secure your car.

A polite discussion about FOBs and theft of our vehicles in a thread about a class action lawsuit against GM for FOBs and thefts of Camaros is way "off topic"? A little high-strung there, are we? Jesus. LOL. Deep breaths. You'll be fine.

[LancevanceZLE]

Originally Posted by Texas1ss

Please carry your frustration in people discussing key FOBs in a thread actually entitled "Class Action Lawsuit For Easily Hackable Keyfobs" elsewhere.

Thanks.

The text of the article shows it's not the fobs.

[LancevanceZLE]

Originally Posted by Texas1ss

A polite discussion about FOBs and theft of our vehicles in a thread about a class action lawsuit against GM for FOBs and thefts of Camaros is way "off topic"? A little high-strung there, are we? Jesus. LOL. Deep breaths. You'll be fine.

No, you've derailed the entire thread. Go to the security threads. This is about the class action lawsuit.

[Texas1ss]

Originally Posted by LancevanceZLE

The text of the article shows it's not the fobs.

The first paragraph of the article:

"GM is in the crosshairs of another class action lawsuit, this one alleging that some 2010 model-year and newer vehicles in its lineup – specifically the 2010 to 2023 Chevy Camaro – can have their keyfobs easily hacked, enabling theft of the vehicle without setting off its alarm."

And it continues. Not to mention the actual title of the article. Now, please, again, carry your frustrations elsewhere. It's, honestly, ridiculous. And you won't get a response from me after this, so post whatever floats your boat.

Thanks.

[z28pat]

As someone who had their 6th gen stolen I can tell you the manual transmission was NOT a deterrent, maybe for the casual joy rider. The issue with these cars is the ease with which you can reprogram keys through the obdii port. Break a window, get in , plug in, drive away.

[roostere4]

Just to clear up some confusion. A relay attack does not only allow a thief to open the doors on the car, but also start it.

Rolling codes on a key fob do NOT prevent this attack!
They only prevent replay attacks, which plagued earlier keyfobs.
A relay attack simply reduces the distance between where the key is and the car. Hence the value in faraday boxes and pouches.

The car thinks the key fob is in/near it, like the owner would have. After they start the car, it can then be driven away. There are at least a couple of threads that discuss the fact that once the car is started it can be driven away without needing the fob to be inside.

So there is no need even for a key programming tool. But it does require some ability to intercept the key fob signal in the first place

This video gives a decent overview of this attack



So breaking a window and programming a new key is an easier method in most circumstances.

[LancevanceZLE]

Originally Posted by roostere4

Just to clear up some confusion. A relay attack does not only allow a thief to open the doors on the car, but also start it.

Rolling codes on a key fob do NOT prevent this attack!
They only prevent replay attacks, which plagued earlier keyfobs.
A relay attack simply reduces the distance between where the key is and the car. Hence the value in faraday boxes and pouches.

The car thinks the key fob is in/near it, like the owner would have. After they start the car, it can then be driven away. There are at least a couple of threads that discuss the fact that once the car is started it can be driven away without needing the fob to be inside.

So there is no need even for a key programming tool. But it does require some ability to intercept the key fob signal in the first place

This video gives a decent overview of this attack



So breaking a window and programming a new key is an easier method in most circumstances.

Breaking the window is so much easier, as the car can be stolen regardless of where the owner is. A broken window doesn't even set off the alarm. This explains why drivers side windows are so hard to get.

Pretty much every stolen Camaro that's been rcoeverd or attempted has had either its driver side window or sunroof smashed in. Relay attacks are very rare these days.

[Malbjey]

I am absolutely stunned that some people here are debating the correct security measures, as if there aren't hundreds of forum posts (here an elsewhere) with very clear answers: you need MULTIPLE levels of security on your car. That includes:


1) Faraday pouch for key fobs(s)
2) OBD port lock (or relocation/fake)
3) A kill switch
4) An old fashioned visible deterrence like 'The Club' or something similar


Frankly, from what I've read items 1) and 2) are the most important. They won't stop criminals from smashing your window but you will at least still have your car unless they spend A LOT of time trying to steal it or flatbed it away.


There shouldn't be any debate as to whether you get a Faraday pouch or additional OBD port security. DO THEM BOTH.



I would still add The Club as visual deterrent. I know it can be defeated easily, but that is extra time for you to respond (if you're around) and extra time for the criminal to figure out and defeat the Faraday and OBD security.

[90503]

I'm curious/confused lol about this lawsuit. Specifically the linked article states "GM is in the crosshairs of another class action lawsuit, this one alleging that some 2010 model-year and newer vehicles in its lineup – specifically the 2010 to 2023 Chevy Camaro – can have their keyfobs easily hacked, enabling theft of the vehicle without setting off its alarm."

My question is the 2010 and 2011 Camaros (Mine is a 2011 2ss) as far as I know do not have remote start. It still takes a key. The fob locks/unlocks but there is no starting the car with the key fob for those years. Not sure why they would list those years, unless its an automatic/manual trans thing.

[The Maverick]

Originally Posted by Malbjey

1) Faraday pouch for key fobs(s)
2) OBD port lock (or relocation/fake)
3) A kill switch
4) An old fashioned visible deterrence like 'The Club' or something similar

Great summary! I would add two tweaks:

As a multi-layer approach to relay attacks, item 1 should be accompanied by disabling the setting that allows you to open the car door using the button on the door.

Also, an OBD lock plus a dummy OBD port is a good variation on item 2, making that an and/or option.

The best fit of options also depends on how your vehicle is used - such as garage-kept weekend driver versus daily commuter.

I still haven't found a visible deterrent that I have felt measures up to my commuter-Camaro needs. While I get the visible deterrent angle regarding the Club, my concern about that option is: (1) failed/cheap lock mechanism - leaves you stuck when you can't open it (check reviews of the item you are looking at), (2) one Club defeat used by crooks is to cut the steering wheel. The issue I found is that models designed with a configuration to address concern #2 often had reviews complaining about issue #1...

Edit: After posting this I remembered that one forum member previously suggested a creative solution to these sort of "club concerns" - use an unlocked club as a visible deterrent.

[havelegs]

Originally Posted by z28pat

As someone who had their 6th gen stolen I can tell you the manual transmission was NOT a deterrent, maybe for the casual joy rider. The issue with these cars is the ease with which you can reprogram keys through the obdii port. Break a window, get in , plug in, drive away.

Same here, had my 21 LT1 m6 stolen too. Not sure the method but the window wasn't broken. I can only assume they grabbed my fob signal while I was in the hotel.

[Texas1ss]

Originally Posted by Malbjey

I am absolutely stunned that some people here are debating the correct security measures, as if there aren't hundreds of forum posts (here an elsewhere) with very clear answers: you need MULTIPLE levels of security on your car. That includes:


1) Faraday pouch for key fobs(s)
2) OBD port lock (or relocation/fake)
3) A kill switch
4) An old fashioned visible deterrence like 'The Club' or something similar


Frankly, from what I've read items 1) and 2) are the most important. They won't stop criminals from smashing your window but you will at least still have your car unless they spend A LOT of time trying to steal it or flatbed it away.


There shouldn't be any debate as to whether you get a Faraday pouch or additional OBD port security. DO THEM BOTH.


I would still add The Club as visual deterrent. I know it can be defeated easily, but that is extra time for you to respond (if you're around) and extra time for the criminal to figure out and defeat the Faraday and OBD security.

I've got 1 and 4 taken care of. The Faraday pouch just came in today. And no club, but I have a metal brace I can put over my brake pedal and then click it up to where the brake pedal won't move.

Of course, that can be easily drilled out from the top until I design a metal plate to cover where they can get to it and have it locked down tight. They can't hacksaw through the actual device. It would take a ton of time because it's heavy gauge steal and thick.

Number 2 is next on the list.

Edit: And, honestly, I wouldn't care if there were thousands of these topics discussed and debating on security measures if it saves one person from getting their car jacked. We worked too hard for them to lose them to shitbag thiefs. If I didn't like the thread, I'd just move on, if this was something somebody already knew about and was well versed in. I've already seen varying information in here, some good, and some missing the mark, but sifting through the BS and more info helps us all. But that's just me.

[Texas1ss]

Originally Posted by arpad_m

This cheap pouch works surprisingly well, I can't get into the car or, once inside, start it with the fob in the pouch, no matter how close to the receiver I try to place it: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B092PQQ5J5

Just got them in today, arpad_m, and they definitely work. Not bad at all for the price. Had a concern about it because of the price, but took your suggestion, and works like a charm.

Now to making a metal cover for the place they can drill out and try to get around the brake/clutch pedal lock I purchased for 80 bucks. Then to the OBD.

Thanks again.