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Old 05-21-2013, 09:18 PM   #43
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For 1 you do not have a functional C7 PCM, you have a static paper weight
PCM is not the commander/router of the car it is the BCM.

Looking at a PCM static and OFF-board says nothing
E92 has been around for 3 years so you have nothing new but what you do not have is being GM has not completed federal testing any code segments in PCM today are not the production and can change a lot before testing is completed and passes those tests and then EPA testing.

Who cares what off board is unless your saying that once in real world and BCM or even Onstar are in the network and your over coming those security policies or even the client/server process is one thing, off board who cares as not what the car owner will deal with UNLESS the beginning of C7 tuning requires the owners to yank the PCM and send it out for a BLIND off board tuning

Being the C7 is still in design and no parts are allowed outside of those in GM contract I am surprised you in public are thumping you received a production coded C7 PCM without certification

As a tuner business for 20 years I would be the first to want to bring in C7 customers the difference is I would never take a non American tuning product and hype custom tuning that is safe, will not wack warranty and would not blow LT1s up
Add the facts there is not even 3rd party DI fuel injectors or even the fact the intake and exhaust values have swapped positions says this time vendors cannot claim "secret CAM grinds" for the C6, even the LS7 that turns out are nothing but C5 grinds from Crane or Comp Cams as with VTT that game cannot be played.
Tues will be useless unless there will be the mods to tune for and C7 alone being a small volume seller must rely on if vendors want to support LT1s used in GM pickups and then learn the differences with C7


History says it all, when C6 Z06 came out and efilive spouted their marketing hype it did not take long when a ton of LS7s blew to hell and what was common with those I worked with was the E38 had been first tuned with efilive.

Same goes when the A6 came out and in fact so much damage it was the tipping point of GM Warren to construct the process for dealers to determine if PCM was hacked and thus everyone paying for crap tuners who make glossy marketing claims.

I am sure GM Corp would have an interest how your saying a tuning product is ready and did your designing with a fully production C7 before one has hit the street legally.

CVN is NOT the only thing GM would look for to see is someone has been hacking as CVN is code segment versions and not flash space.

Being your in MI, near 7 mile I am sure GM would love to stop by and see your final product tuning tool

And No I am not disqualified to assure people buying this next gen C7 are not being sucked into taking the new designed LT1 and hacking it with mods right from the get go.
Let others be the testpig so some tuning tool vendor can ruin the engine is their path to claiming a moral victory as being the FIRST to blow a LT1 up.

When ON board C7 tuning is possible then let us know

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTPprix View Post
You also said and I quote



This right here disqualifies you from basically talking about ANY of this with any authority.

1. Its not a Siemens box its a GMH (Delphi) box.
2. Its a BRAND NEW controller it hasn't been used ANYWHERE except these NA applications.
3. CVN process is EXACTLY the same as the E39A!

So please take your OWN advice and go do your homework.

But hey what do I know I'm only the guy that actually has a C7 ECM for development sitting right in front of him.
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Old 05-22-2013, 09:18 PM   #44
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Ok, so trying to bring this a little more on topic.

Let's step back and look at this logically, and review what has happened, and what we know today.

1. NOT a siemens processor. it is Delphi

2. not a locked bootloader, at least on the ECM (which is really all that matters, who cares if it can be flashed across the bus, it's not like these are bonded into the car)

3. if they don't lock truck (a much larger market for tuning, and flashing back to stock for warranty scams) they won't lock corvette

4. it's an entirely new ecm family, not an ecm currently used by ANY other OEM

again, maybe you are right, and yes, people should choose their shops with caution. I am glad we are buying a shop car, and have over 4 years of DI tuning under our belt to prepare for this day.

I am glad that tuning support is, and will be available.

BTW, I assume you don't know who GTPPrix is, and I know you two are having a heated discussion, but the guy does know a thing or two about GM and how their vehicle integrations operate and function. He's passionate for sure, and that is a good thing to have with a car guy.
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Old 05-24-2013, 10:51 AM   #45
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Man, I forgot to make popcorn before reading this thread.

Things I've gathered from all of this.

A: I'm happy I'm naturally a positive thinker.
B: I'm happy I have my own C7 on order to play with.
C: I'm glad the basis of my order was not because of the warranty.

Considering I have been tuning long enough to remember the OBDI swaps into OBDII cars, I suppose I would consider myself a bit of a veteran at this point. Though in the 80's I was still playing in sand box's so no eprom tuning here (thank God).

I'd say it goes back to the whole E38 debate. Everyone was all like, "OMG Dynamic VE is going to make tuning impossible"... Then everyone discovered dynamic airflow rpm disable. So I think everyone's got the whole MAF tuning thing down. In fact if you can't tune a maf, may the good lord help you.

Having said that, I emailed Bill @ HP Tuners while reading this thread and he confirmed (in the attached screen shot) they fully anticipate E92 support in the 2.25 release. As with any new platform, I'm sure the adjustable parameters at first with be a bit basic... but that's never stopped any of us. Shit, back in the day we did a cam swap on a C6Z before anyone supported them at all (made 505 on the stock tune). So yeah, doom and gloom isn't going to stop any of us from figuring these things out. If you sit around thinking about things too much, you'll never get anything done... which is the general gest I get from this whole thread.

This is America after all... Not Europe. If they can't figure these things out that's their problem.

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Old 05-26-2013, 02:59 PM   #46
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Ahhhh much better. BTW Chuck I cut my shrouds with a plasma cutter; just sayin.
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Old 05-26-2013, 08:51 PM   #47
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This thread was better before half of it got deleted.
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Old 05-27-2013, 02:13 AM   #48
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off topic but wasnt the GTR's ecu uncrackcable and now we see 1000hp gtrs everywhere
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Old 05-27-2013, 12:04 PM   #49
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off topic but wasnt the GTR's ecu uncrackcable and now we see 1000hp gtrs everywhere
Nah I'd say thats actually pretty on topic
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Old 06-24-2013, 02:41 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by LOWDOWN View Post
There's FAR more V6 Camaros, out there, than there are BOSS/Shelby/GT-R examples, yet the FACT remains myriad "attempts" and "promises" have come up short...be they n/a or boosted. From emporiums with stellar efforts on most other ECMs.

Getting into DI applications with their extremely high fuel pressures requires very precise calibrations, NOT "good enough" piggyback apps...and for those to be accomplished requires direct OEM/Tier "support".

Stay tuned...
The reasons most shops don't mess with the V6 stuff is because there is no solid businesscase for it.

The cost/benefit of getting 500 horsepower or anything higher, there is no argument that can truly be made.

The only argument that could be made is "Make 500 horses with 30mpg", which would be nice, but is there truly a line of people checkbooks in hand ready to sign up for that? Nope.

This isn't meant to discourage the V6 guys, but any company has to look at "does this make sense" and it really does not. Plus drivetrain upgrades, R&D, etc etc. Just snowballs.
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Old 06-24-2013, 02:43 PM   #51
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Originally Posted by Andy@Livernois View Post
So it sounds like everyone is just saying lets not even try? Again, if we believed what everyone on the internet said we could do we wouldn't have even tried on Ecoboost Ford applications. EVERYONE said the same doom and gloom type stories with it's encryption too. Same with 2011-12 Chrysler, encryption too complex for the aftermarket to figure out. It is quite interesting that so many people say it CAN'T be done, yet the car isn't even in any customer's or shop's hands yet.

Hey, MAYBE I'm wrong, but then again I have history on my side saying I'm right, and we will gain access to it. Also, just because the people who have tried to tune other applications that utilize this controller think its too complicated to understand doesn't mean we will. A Human wrote the code, programming language, etc. I am pretty sure other humans can figure it out. This isn't our first go around with DI tuning, Our business is developing, and improving on brand new engine families, especially when no one else thinks it can be done.

93 when LT1 was announced it was going to move to flash memory everyone said it would be untunable. WRONG

95 when everything was moving to OBD-II everyone said it would be untunable. WRONG

96 when the LS1 was revealed everyone said it would be untunable. WRONG

05 when we moved to an E40 everyone said it would be untunable. WRONG

06 when GM moved to E38 everyone said it would be untunable. WRONG

08 when DI stated being used (LNF Cobalt) everyone said it would be untunable. WRONG

That is just the GM applications that were doom and gloom. There may be some downtime while the aftermarket figures it out, but with enough backing and time, it gets done.

All further complexity in engine design and management does is further separate the good shops from the bad, exposing their true knowledge and skill set.

Took the words right out of my mouth. Looking forward to seeing what you guys come up with and competing with y'all in the Stingray segment!
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Old 06-29-2013, 10:48 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike@HennesseyPerformance View Post
Took the words right out of my mouth. Looking forward to seeing what you guys come up with and competing with y'all in the Stingray segment!
Thank you for the kind words. You will see some of what we have going on, very, very soon
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Old 07-02-2013, 05:48 PM   #53
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Dan just finished up tuning our 2014 5.3L Chevrolet Silverado, pretty impressive numbers for a bone stock engine with just some tuning a changing out fuel!

Green=baseline 87 octane
Red= 87 performance
Blue= 93 performance
Remember this is a bone stock engine, only things changed were the tune and fuel!
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Old 07-02-2013, 05:50 PM   #54
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Quote:
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Took the words right out of my mouth. Looking forward to seeing what you guys come up with and competing with y'all in the Stingray segment!
$20 side bet to see who has the faster 7 speed manual C7 Stingray!!!!
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Old 07-28-2013, 01:04 PM   #55
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Now this talk of $20 side bets is what it is all about! I love it!
I for one will be one of the first to line up with my checkbook to get big gains out of my new Vette. I pushed my new Camaro to 706 RWHP and can't wait to see what we can do with this new toy. Think about a 1,000 lbs lighter with that horsepower.......

Sign me up!!!!!
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Old 07-29-2013, 10:20 AM   #56
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Quote:
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Now this talk of $20 side bets is what it is all about! I love it!
I for one will be one of the first to line up with my checkbook to get big gains out of my new Vette. I pushed my new Camaro to 706 RWHP and can't wait to see what we can do with this new toy. Think about a 1,000 lbs lighter with that horsepower.......

Sign me up!!!!!
We will keep the boards posted on our developments, but we are almost completed on many of our engine upgrade items for the new GenV engines.
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