My 50th birthday GT500 or ZL1?

[SIRLOIN]

Originally Posted by Coolidge

Sirloin 7k rpm is off idle to Forumula 1 fans. I'd buy this minivan over both the ZL1 and GT500! Fast foward to 1:27 in the video.

And the point of this video is what Coolidge?

[CoolestCamaro873]

Originally Posted by MauriSSio

Im sure the MR is great, but if the bilsteins were that far behind, the GTR wouldnt be so successful running them. Ferrari and Audi rely on them because im sure their customer base appreciates the ease of use.

I think you are missing my point. I'm positive the Billsteins are very capable as a aggressive suspension.

Hell a Boss 302 has an adjustable suspension, but it is very stiff and uncomfortable on choppy to rough roads as a daily driver. A GTR while it is one of the best bargain sports cars, borderline supercars on the market, it also suffers from not being as comfortable as its opponents for daily driving which is why it is not considered a Supercar/GT such as the Ferrari, Audi, and Porsches of the world.

So while I am positive the Billsteins used in the GT500 are going to be able to tear it up on the track, I doubt it will maych the daily comfort and sophistication of the MR suspension. I think GM was aiming for a more GT like feel to the ZL1 so that it could be the best of both worlds.

Both suspensions are great but shine in different areas. So it is easy to say that Audi, Ferrari, etc... use the MR suspension for ease of use but I'm sure that a couple of Germans and Italians would say the GTR is nothing more than a Nissan, a Japanese brand that lacks the sophistication of the leaders in the automotive world when it comes to sportscars/supercars.

I am not saying I agree with them, but there is an argument for every side!

[CoolestCamaro873]

Originally Posted by Deki

Actually, the Mustang does have heated mirrors, heated seats, rear park assist and camera, remote trunk release, and an auto dimming rear view mirror. Like I said, you made up your mind when you created this thread, so it's a pointless thread where Camaro vs. Mustang crowd just tries to prove their car is better. Everyone talking about the street comfort of the ZL1 with the MR, take one for a drive and then you can state it as fact. If it's anything like the ZR-1, it rides good for a super car, but a smooth ride it is not.

In Touring mode the MR suspension is as smooth as any sportscar/supercar/GT-car suspension will get. As the owner of a '11 Grand Sport with the Gen. 2 MR suspension I found it to be as smooth as any BMW, Audi, Porsche, etc... I have ever owned.

I have driven the ZR1 and R8 which both feature similiar suspensions and even they were smooth.

I think when we use the word "smooth" we have to take into acconut that we are talking in relation or in comparison to other sports cars, supercars, GT cars. When someone buys this type of car, I would hope they know that it will not be smooth like a luxury sedan. So for what it is trying to be, it is smooth in relation to the competition.

If you want real smooth go buy a Buick or Cadillac.

[Coolidge]

Originally Posted by Deki

Actually, the Mustang does have heated mirrors, heated seats, rear park assist and camera, remote trunk release, and an auto dimming rear view mirror. Like I said, you made up your mind when you created this thread, so it's a pointless thread where Camaro vs. Mustang crowd just tries to prove their car is better. Everyone talking about the street comfort of the ZL1 with the MR, take one for a drive and then you can state it as fact. If it's anything like the ZR-1, it rides good for a super car, but a smooth ride it is not.

Okay I found the auto dimming mirror but I don't see any of the other features listed on Ford's web site for the GT500. Not saying it doesn't have it just that I can't find it listed.

The thread may seem pointless to you but its been helpful to me. I have owned 6 Fords and 0 Chevy's and the information some have shared has been helpful.

[Coolidge]

Originally Posted by SIRLOIN

And the point of this video is what Coolidge?

To get you to lighten up.

[72MachOne99GT]

Originally Posted by Steve Dallas

Yes, and the Mustang still uses "old technology" in their solid rear axle.

I'd be more concerned about that than the pushrods...

You seem to be the only one who missed the sarcasm.

I was saying in jest, that it's "pathetic" that GM only made 580 hp from their "old technology" pushrod motor.

Since you seemed to miss the point of my post (why, when you've already made up your mind, would you post such a stupid YES STUPID question, on this site) I'll respond by saying GMs old tech made a ridiculous 631 hp before the zl1, and fords "old technology" is going to tear road courses up

the pissing match doesn't need to stop, that's half the fun, it's all the insecurity and guys getting way too defensive over a damn car most people won't be able to afford

[2cnd chance]

Exactly!

[oldlugs]

For those thinking the new 5.8 GT500 block isn't rebuildable, I think you may be wrong. Here's a pic of a 5.4 block sleeved to make it a 5.8:



My guess is that the new 5.8 can be sleeved as well. Not as inexpensive as a simple re-bore, but looks like it can be done.

[MauriSSio]

Originally Posted by CoolestCamaro873

I think you are missing my point. I'm positive the Billsteins are very capable as a aggressive suspension.

Hell a Boss 302 has an adjustable suspension, but it is very stiff and uncomfortable on choppy to rough roads as a daily driver. A GTR while it is one of the best bargain sports cars, borderline supercars on the market, it also suffers from not being as comfortable as its opponents for daily driving which is why it is not considered a Supercar/GT such as the Ferrari, Audi, and Porsches of the world.

So while I am positive the Billsteins used in the GT500 are going to be able to tear it up on the track, I doubt it will maych the daily comfort and sophistication of the MR suspension. I think GM was aiming for a more GT like feel to the ZL1 so that it could be the best of both worlds.

Both suspensions are great but shine in different areas. So it is easy to say that Audi, Ferrari, etc... use the MR suspension for ease of use but I'm sure that a couple of Germans and Italians would say the GTR is nothing more than a Nissan, a Japanese brand that lacks the sophistication of the leaders in the automotive world when it comes to sportscars/supercars.

I am not saying I agree with them, but there is an argument for every side!

is a ferrari f40 not a supercar then since it lacks refinement? until these last couple years, fans of american cars hated refinement when it came to their supercars. Starting with the nsx. It was the first real supercar status exotic that you can comfortably drive everyday and fans of the other exotics hatred it and said it was a car with no "soul" but was a very capable chassis. When the gtr came out, people said pretty much the same thing. my how things have changed!!!

[CoolestCamaro873]

Originally Posted by MauriSSio

is a ferrari f40 not a supercar then since it lacks refinement? until these last couple years, fans of american cars hated refinement when it came to their supercars. Starting with the nsx. It was the first real supercar status exotic that you can comfortably drive everyday and fans of the other exotics hatred it and said it was a car with no "soul" but was a very capable chassis. When the gtr came out, people said pretty much the same thing. my how things have changed!!!

I wouldn't say Americans hated refinement. I think Americans feared what refinement would do to the cost of our rather low-cost sports cars such as the Viper and Corvette, I know the Viper was anywhere from $70-90k depending on the decade but it was rather cheap for what is was in comparison to the competition in its respected year of production.

Americans supported the simplicity of a sportscar not because of its characteristics, but because its lack of refinement made it affordable to the masses when in comparison to a Porsche, Audi, BMW, MB, Ferrari, Maserati, Lamborgini, etc...

In '05 GM brought out the C6 which was comparable to a Ferrari 360 (a $130k car) at the time in acceleration for the price of $44k. Of course the interior of the Vette and suspension, etc... lacked the refinement of the Italian Stallion but you would expect it to for almost $100k less. The point was a blue collar guy could go buy a Vette and be able to go nearly as fast as a Ferrari for almost 1/3 the cost.

Now when non American brands produce automobiles all bets are off because the market has a different buyer and pulse to go with it, which will dictate trends. The NSX was not successful in a decade where refinement was not really a priority to most sports car manufacturers even the Germans, Italians, British, and Japanese. It was an era of Toyota Supras, Nissan 300ZXs, Chevrolet Corvettes, Dodge Vipers, etc...

The NSX was just ahead of its time, it belongs here and now where Corvettes and Camaros share technology with Ferrari and Audi and the refinement of a GT car has become more of a prioirty in sports and supercars.